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​In this video, I explore my journey of outgrowing Mormonism—a transition from a magic worldview where miracles suspend cause and effect to a view of reality grounded in natural laws and reason. ​When you're raised inside a religious belief system, mystical ideas feel completely normal. But as the "shadow of the Enlightenment" falls over church history, the contrast between magic and reason can become difficult to ignore. ​💬 Question for the comments: Which mystical or magical idea in church history was the one that ultimately broke your shelf? LINKS Church History Matters - Book of Mormon Translation https://youtu.be/ChLPminCdJk?is=wrxXZtOeoFLXG9dx Mormwiththosewhomormed on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/reel/DaEK8t0tdXe/?igsh=MW5oZDVobGgwazY1OQ== SUGGESTED VIDEOS My shelf was unbreakable https://youtu.be/19BX8UHesrg?is=gm8APfuGt3GDhrNt The Story of Korihor https://youtu.be/YyLXrjyW6jg?is=9jxUSsmgTLUEqEkz
How I Outgrew MY LDS Magic Worldview
The In Alma 30, the story of Korihor contains what I believe are three of the most common forms of religious manipulation—not just in the Book of Mormon, but throughout scripture. In this video, I break down how each tactic works, why it's persuasive, and how they all point to the same underlying pattern: replacing independent thought with authoritarianism. - Manipulation #1: "Believe...or else." The false choice between faith and demanding a sign. How appeals to authority and power undermine genuine free will and independent thought. - Manipulation #2: "You've had enough evidence." We'll explore the claim that unbelief is simply stubbornness - Manipulation #3: "It's unreasonable not to believe." The claim that reason and sense experience are inherently inadequate. Ultimately, all three forms of manipulation share the same goal: to get reason out of the way. Whether by threatening consequences, declaring the evidence already settled, or claiming faith is the only reliable path to truth, each approach discourages people from thinking independently. Links: Shane Baldwins Korihor threat on Mormonism Live https://www.youtube.com/live/RyejJHP2ZzE?is=vuLvDcNN_Su9Jnj0 My Video about Shane Baldwin https://youtu.be/oOnRLe0wzSo?is=fc-635MnPPQrc_gw Elder Bednar "That Ye May Believe - part I" https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/that-ye-may-believe/part-1?lang=eng Elder Oaks "Our Strength Can Become Our Downfall" https://youtu.be/X5xCeiXDN9E?is=xB8DsdTnfB9kU3v_ ​00:00 - Introduction & The Story of Korihor An introduction to three manipulative ideas about truth in the Book of Mormon, using the debate between the prophet Alma and Korihor the anti-Christ in Alma 30 as a case study. ​07:27 - Manipulation #1: "Might Makes Right" (Believe or Else) An analysis of how the threat of physical or divine punishment (like Korihor being struck dumb) is used to bypass objective reasoning, framing disbelief as a dangerous threat. ​11:15 - Modern Parallel: Baldwin vs. Dehlin A look at a recent online exchange where a believer uses the Korihor narrative to threaten a critic with a priesthood "cursing" ordinance. ​16:04 - Manipulation #2: The Overstatement of Design A critique of Alma’s argument that God's existence is so obvious that any disbeliever is inherently dishonest or lying to themselves. ​21:15 - Manipulation #3: Bypassing Reason for "The Spirit" An examination of LDS epistemology, which asserts that spiritual feelings (the Holy Ghost) are more reliable than physical senses and logical deduction. ​31:12 - The Orthodoxy Trap & Conclusion A discussion on the logical flaws of relying on subjective feelings for truth, concluding with an encouragement to reclaim personal reasoning.
Three Manipulative Ideas in The Book of Mormon
My wife and I were true beliving Latter-day Saints our whole lives. 18 years into our marriage we began deconstructing our faith. That is when I discovered that my wife never had a testimony of the Atonement of Jesus Christ, even though she was a beliving member. Looking back I credit her for having a stronger moral compass than me. she was unwilling to buy in to the Atonement because she knew that it wasn't possible to avoid the consequences of our actions.
A Discussion with My Wife About the Atonement
Aristotle's critique of Plato's World of Forms reveals a fundamental truth about reality: abstractions are not entities. The Atonement is based on Plato’s error of treating abstract concepts as if they exist as physical things in another dimension Aristotle’s rejected this. He realized that form and matter cannot be separated. Actiins and consequences can never be separated. ​"Running" can't exist without a runner, and "orange" can't exist without an orange object and sin only exists as a wring choice tide to an individuals character. You can't transfer your piano practice hours to someone else, and you can't transfer your moral choices. #lds #deconstruction
How Aristotles Rejection of Plato Highlights the problem with The Atonement
​My reaction to an interview with Shane Baldwin on Mormon Book Reviews. Shane Baldwin tells his story of meeting John the Beloved, who was allowed to tarry until the return of Jesus. I relate my own story of what it was like being a Mormon mystic. The Interview https://youtu.be/gC1-S-d98uM?is=U7-dkOrn5BE4sMjc Baptists at our BBQ https://youtu.be/wMcSijmf79I?is=LYSyufEh5rFUa7Qk
Mormon Mysticism and Shane Baldwin
The Book of Mormon survives largely as an argument from ignorance: "You can't prove it false, therefore it might be true." The narrative is free to change to answer the problems. • The many anachronisms in the text, including horses, cattle, elephants, swine, chariots, silk, iron, and steel. • Translation issues and Christian concepts that appear centuries before they should, including terms such as Christ, synagogue, and even the concept of a bound book. • DNA evidence and passages such as 2 Nephi 1:8 There is also an interesting irony here. If the Book of Mormon were conclusively proven true, there would be no need to gain a testimony through the Holy Ghost. Evidence would compel belief. The LDS truth-claim depends on remaining just uncertain enough that faith can fill the gap. For many members experiencing a faith crisis, the BOM becomes the last line of defense: not evidence that the Book of Mormon is true, but the inability to prove it false. "Informal Fallacies, Part 1" by: Leonard Peikoff https://youtu.be/U3Jm8zF7bJ8?is=i1jn83LhXNy-3hOg Elder Holland- Safety for the Soul - LDS General Conference https://youtu.be/2gAOrQBXEks?is=LoRZ5SxCbyuxdetv Let's Get Real - Interview with David Snell https://youtu.be/OH6iKdSzDbQ?is=hIbDzUWXYMIrgTX- DanVogel Book of Mormon Witnesses P1 https://youtu.be/v-jNV6jN-VQ?is=cz0CLxSgdegxnLE7 Grant Palmer on the witnesses "second sight" https://youtu.be/3KpYoMGCqpE?is=LUlDqmEWNVE5aNrk Dr John Lundwall on Mormonish https://youtu.be/xu6VV9Nfq3E?is=vsLrvFb-6o54BE4e
The Book of Mormon and the argument from ignorance
John Larsen on Mormon Stories https://www.youtube.com/live/pEtCMHkpG-M?si=H-8a-tbAhS009z4b
The LDS Plan of Salvation Can't Stand Up to Scrutiny
In this video I explore a foundational principle within LDS theology that, if fully embraced leads out Mormonism. That principle is objectivity. Latter-day Saint scriptures and prophets reject the idea of creation ex nihilo — the belief that God created everything out of absolute nothingness. Instead, the Book of Abraham says, “We will go down, for there is space there…” (Abraham 3:24). That small phrase carries massive philosophical implications. If there is “space there,” then something exists independent of God. Space is not created by Him. It simply is. And if objective reality exists independently of God, then truth itself cannot merely be whatever authority declares it to be. In this episode I examine how LDS theology accidentally opens the door to objective reality, objective truth, and objective morality — concepts that ultimately undermine systems built on obedience to prophetic authority. If reality exists independent of any prophet, institution, or even God Himself, then truth must be discovered through objective means. King Follett Discourse https://josephsmithfoundation.org/docs/the-king-follett-sermon/ LDS Book of Abraham https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/pgp/abr/3?lang=eng
The Principle at the Heart of the LDS Worldview that Leads Out of Mormonism
While I was still a fully believing TBM, a close friend called me and told me his shelf had broken. He brought up things like the rock in the hat, and the Book of Abraham translation. Honestly… I wasn’t phased. Of course Mormonism sounded unbelievable. It was supposed to. I viewed Mormonism like two puzzles: One was the physical puzzle — the historical evidence, the contradictions, the archaeology, the translation issues. The other was the spiritual puzzle — happiness, morality, meaning, purpose, principles, the feeling that the story “fit together.” As long as the spiritual puzzle worked, it didn’t bother me that the physical one didn’t. I assumed the answers would come later. My shelf felt unbreakable. But eventually the spiritual puzzle stopped fitting too. That’s when things changed. I didn’t just deconstruct Mormonism historically — I outgrew it philosophically. Video referenced: https://youtu.be/UP8NRgWtPaE?si=L017LLQdY-isGY2q Historian Dan Vogel on all three shelf items: Seer Stone https://youtu.be/uawcYN-O8t4?si=ualWLRblZT_8Hn6r Book of Abraham https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLjxwXGB2KzRaejlyYHN1Lm9qDYmUpGgQw&si=1btqgW91OZHqzHBY First Vision https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLjxwXGB2KzRYW4_WgycBuAerb3pGPog7R&si=vnvXGTEhYqRIDCex
Why My Mormon Shelf Was Unbreakable
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